Hardener??

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Hardener??

Post by MikeC. on March 2nd 2012, 12:09 pm

Hi all,

I've started gathering the supplies I'll need for painting my Ford Ranger next week and one of the things I haven't gotten yet is paint hardener.

After reviewing the info on the forum, I see that many folks on here have different opinions as to whether or not we should be using a hardener for these type projects. Personally, I like the idea of using one. That's only because it makes me feel like my paint will dry harder faster if I do use it. That said, I'm a noob when it comes to all this and really haven't the faintest idea as to what'll give me the best results.

If anyone here has experience using a hardener and would be willing to share their likes/dislikes regarding using it, please drop a reply for me.

Also, for those you have used a hardener, and stand by that technique, what kind of hardener should I use when applying the oil based Rustoleum?

I'll be using a 20oz. HVLP gravity fed spray gun to apply the paint. (Just in case that matters)

Thanks,

Mike C.
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Re: Hardener??

Post by cac1967 on March 2nd 2012, 10:30 pm

I have used nason acrylic enamel hardner and thinner on the door jamb's on my black 1987 ranger, does just fine with rusto, give's you better control with flowout and hardness" i.e. gloss" hope this help's!!!! thumbs up
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Re: Hardener??

Post by 63Falconconvert on March 5th 2012, 9:55 am

When I painted my quarters and trunk lid I used a hardener in the mix for all 10 coats. I know some guys will only add a hardener to the last 2 coats and they got great results. Doing it my way does waste a lot of paint. Once you mix in hardener your paint only has a few hour self life before it hardens up so I got good at figuring out how much paint to mix per coat. When I roll the rest of my car I will use my same mix adding hardener to every coat.
I used Valspar emamel hardener from Tractor Supply;
http://www.tractorsupply.com/valspar-enamel-hardner-8-fl-oz--3449669

Hope this helps
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Re: Hardener??

Post by VeggieBullet on August 8th 2013, 7:44 pm

Any idea o about where to get hardener?
tried looking into HD or Lowes without luck
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Re: Hardener??

Post by Samilcar on August 9th 2013, 12:10 pm

Ebay is where I bought mine (along with some other painting supplies).
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Re: Hardener??

Post by VeggieBullet on August 9th 2013, 6:15 pm

Samilcar wrote:Ebay is where I bought mine (along with some other painting supplies).
Thanks for the input.
We have almost everything need it to start the project except of the hardener.
Can we start the first couple of coats and add the hardener to the last 6 to 8 coats?
Or, Does the hardener has to be added from the beginning?
Also, a Hardener does not have the same function as the Drier does?
Saw people using Penetrol ( in theory slows the curing time helping the leveling process) mixing with Japan Drier (to speed up the drying process), I'm totally lost if this is counterproductive.
thanks

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Re: Hardener??

Post by Samilcar on August 9th 2013, 8:36 pm

Isocyanate hardeners and Japan driers both harden paint, but use different chemical processes. Japan drier speeds up drying of oil based paints, which makes a thick coat of enamel dry faster and harder than it normally would. A normal thick coat of enamel "skins" as it dries, trapping the un-evaporated oils underneath. This uncured layer will eventually dry as the oils slowly evaporate through the skinned outer layer, but this can take months or years. If you attempt to wet sand or polish a new layer of enamel paint like this before it fully cures, you will break through the shiny top layer and into the soft uncured bottom layer, giving the paint a smeared and dull appearance. Japan drier "pulls" this oil to the surface of the drying paint, making the whole layer of paint dry much quicker. But it wont make the paint any harder than if you had just left a normal thick layer of enamel alone for a few years and let it harden naturally.

Isocyanate hardeners use a chemical that's somewhat similar to superglue, making the paint harder and shinier than Japan drier treated paint. However, isocyanate hardeners are NASTY chemicals, especially if sprayed. If the isocyanate gets into your lungs, it can cause lung damage that might not show up for decades. A full face respirator is highly recommended if spraying. It can also soak into your skin and possibly cause issues, but wearing nitrile gloves while painting helps guard against this.
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Re: Hardener??

Post by VeggieBullet on August 9th 2013, 9:35 pm

thanks for the fast response!
Great info.
Few more questions:
1) So can we start the first few coats with the Japan Drier, and wet sand in between coats?
In that way we can order the Valspar hardener you recommend and used the hardener in the last 4 coats?
2) We were thinking on using penetrol while spraying to have better results but not sure if it makes sense to mix Miniral Spirits, Penetrol and Japan Drier. Sounds too much mixing..
Have a full face mask and hope to start tomorrow if the weather help.

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Re: Hardener??

Post by Samilcar on August 10th 2013, 12:13 pm

Yes, to using Japan drier in the first few coats and using the Valspar hardener only in the last 4 coats. Others have done this with excellent results. I'm not sure about using both Penetrol and Japan drier. It should work, but I don't know if anyone else has ever tried it.
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Re: Hardener??

Post by Prospector on August 13th 2013, 4:42 pm

Tractor Supply sells hardener... pretty good stuff.
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Re: Hardener??

Post by VeggieBullet on August 14th 2013, 6:26 am

thanks guys,
ordered the Valspar from ebay. Its on the way, pretty excited about the project.
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Re: Hardener??

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